UPDATE: Appeal filed for expelled Spotsylvania teen

I’m quite sure there are a lot of things CAPABLE of firing a missle or projectile that are commonly used by students everyday. Most pens could be considered under that catagory. Shall we start expelling people for bringing pens to school?

James,

Since straws “are capable of firing a missile or projectile” under the section you quoted, would you support charging all students with one with either “brandishing a weapon” or “posession of a weapon on school grounds”? Would a pen in your pocket require a “concealed carry” permit? Should all weapons (straws) be removed from the school? I believe the school has now classified pens as a weapon, so all students should be charged with posession of an item that “is capable of firing a missile or projectile.” My God, man, think.

A 5 year old can by a pen at the store. Should we require a background check on pens and straws now? I believe TSA allows pens and straws on flights. They should review their policies based on the findings of the Spotsylvania School Board.

affected*

Brandy,

Read the Code of Conduct and tell me where any reasonable person could figure out that spitballs= expulsion+suspension+criminal charges. I read the Code of Conduct and no reasonable person signing an agreement to that could figure that out. It was wrong and stupid what the student did, and the appropriate discipline should be administered. The issue is if we are going to start calling pens and straws weapons, and jack up punishment on these types of offenses. Do you agree that someone bringing a gun to school and shooting is equal to someone spitting plastic balls out of a pen, and they both should suffer the same consequences at the school? Common Sense people!

Brandy, you’re just as bad as sara. This kid was not a bully. And even if he was, the only way to make it stop is for the bullied kid to stand up to him. Tattling may make it stop, or may make it worse, but either way the “victim” learns only how to continue being the victim. And then those people grow up feeling like you do. Hence zero tolerance policies go into effect to keep outspoken victims like yourself quiet.

Brandi,

I actually think we agree. The kid did wrong, and should of been disciplined. I am not sure if the 10 day suspension was appropriate, but definately seems to be within reason. Is it common kid stuff? I do not think either of us knows the intent here. Was it friends goofing around? I don’t know. But I agree, 10 days suspension would at least make sense to me, and would of more than likely, kept this out of the public eye.

I think the issue here is not the kids actions, but how the Zero Tolerance policy is being applied. It seems originally, the school imposed a 10 day suspension. We didn’t hear anything then on the incident, so I assume all were good with it. It seems that when the school board applied the weapons charge and criminal assualt, mandating an expulsion,for possession of a pen, that this got out of hand. It may be that the school handled this appropriately, but the School Board and Zero Tolerance forced their hand to do all this extra punishment. I think the kid was thrown out in December, so that makes it at least a month or more of suspension so far not to include the criminal side of this. Has he been punished enough?

But why would the school be justified in punishing this kid so harshly, even if the father was upset? That would make it more of a personal vandetta wouldn’t it? The school board has to be objective, and ensure justice is received. The original 10 days should of been it. If your scenario is true, than it is almost like a double jepordy case. You are implying that the school board punished the kid harsher because the father was upset, which is obviously WRONG.

Still, calling pens and straws weapons is where the school board stuck their foot in their mouth big time. The should of kept the original punishment and moved on. And to throw the book at a kid because the father was upset, shows poor judgment. I think if it is discovered that the school board, or school, did anything inappropriately, they should be held accountable just as the kid was. Kids need to also learn that adults are accountable for their actions too.

The plastic pellets had the mass of a Rice Krispy. They are the size of a metal BB, but 1/5 the weight. His previous infractions included bringing a comb that looked like a knife to school, and shooting rubber bands with a ruler. Neither time did he threaten or intimadate anyone. There is no evidence that Andrew refused to give up his “weapon” when asked. Is it appropriate to use deadly force then, since this was an assault? Shouln’t parents be notified that their children may be shot dead for violations?

P.S. Andrew wrote personal letters of apology to the students that were hit and were given to Ms. Andruss. Apparently she did not give them to the students. Andrew is not a bully, has never been in any other trouble. This is the most serious punishment a school can impose. How many taxpayer $$ has it taken to punish this prank?

I wonder if it makes a difference if several of the IP addresses supporting the school are actually coming from the school? Taxpayers are funding the school to support the school during school hours maybe? Hmmm…

My family has, in the past, had to deal with Spotsylvania County Schools Zero Tolerance Policies. I did not nor do not agree with many of their decisions. Not all of the cases that go before the board end up in the newspaper. My brother was expelled, never to return to school, forever changing the course of his life. My brother simply was walking a path through the woods. He came across a broken, knocked down fence. He continued walking, and was stopped by a police officer. It turns out he was standing about 15 to 20 feet onto Chancellor High School property, and that Friday night CHS had a game. The officer asked my brother about weapons. My brother explained he did have a pocket knife on him. He was taken into custody, and later had to go before the board. He was expelled for having a weapon on school property. Well he didn’t know he was on school property, and the fence that should have kept him out was broke. The school knew the fence was broke, and just didn’t care to fix it. He was treated horrible, like a criminal. He did not attend CHS, nor knew he was that close to the school. He was just trying to walk to a friend’s house. That walk changed his life forever. The school board did not care he did not live in the area of that school, or that the fence was down, that this was a child who really did not mean to be on any school property, I mean really 15 to 20 feet. My parents even brought pictures showing how it was a innocent mistake, and most adults would have followed the same path my brother took. The school board understood the CHS was also at fault, but It was a zero..we don’t care..sorry about your luck, bet the fence still isnt fixed Policy!!!!

“Which of you is willing to cast the first stone at this kid?” We all shot, got hit, or observed flying rubber bands during our teenage years.When we got hit, the shooter was usually a good friend having a laugh.
I love Bette Midler and Barbara Walters, and it will be nice to hear their kind words about this. It has gotten worldwide attention in USA and many foreign countries.

Brandy,

The family is practicing their rights in this free country called America.

If you were to go 5 miles over the speed limit, you would be breaking the law. You COULD hurt someone, you COULD kill someone, ete…and because of that the judge sentences you to lfe in prison, because thats what a murderer would get…and you COULD of killed someone.

Then you decide that the punishment is harsh…one side says you knew the rules…no speeding. Then add in that the judge makes up a new rule and says that cars are weapons as they can be used to harm people, and you got the Spotsylvania County Schools position, even worse than the harsh judge. They say, take the punishment, and quit trying to justify what you did. The other side says wait, why is she getting punished for something that never happened, murder, etc, Why didn’t she just get punished for what she did?
The former side is your case, and the latter is the families. What if there is more to the story? What if there is misconduct and disregard of the law on the side of the school? Will you advocate such harsh treatment on the adults misbhavior?

Andrew understands what he did was wrong, and is remorseful. When Andrew was confronted by school personnel, he immediately gave over the pen. One of the children was a friend of his. What about a zero tolerance policy for school personnel? They may have broken several rules in the way they handled Andrew. They called the Sherrif and did not call his father to be present during interrogation, which is clearly against the rules, There are several other areas which the school clearly broke their own rules. The damage they did to him was far greater than any damage he did to his fellow students. Should they not be held accountable? Does he have no rights to defend himself? Even a murder has a right to an attorney. Would you prevent my grandson the same rights? Furthermore, the media contacted him, not vice versa. Andrew’s father accepted the 10 day suspension. The school chose to go for the further punishment. His sister goes to the same school and knows one of the children-that’s how we know he never got the apology letter. All the family is doing is trying to vindicate their child and help him put his life back together.

The boy should have been punished with an ISS, or detention. The school administration and the school board, should be ashamed of themselves. I think it’s time to remove these officials, get out to vote. If this is the best solution they can come up with. The sheriff’s department did not want this to go this far, but the school board moved forward with the support of the school administration. No wonder people are flocking to private schools, or home schooling. The arrogance and incompetence displayed by the school board and school administration is unbelievable. This school board and school administration have made Spotsy County the laughing stock of the country.

And spit balls can be plastic, though they are not recommended for ages 3 and under. I can’t believe they are selling weapons to kids now! I imagine our law enforcement would be quite busy busting all these offenders nationwide. Maybe coordinate a dragnet?

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Wow, I’m amazed at how many comments there are in this discussion. I just had a couple thoughts:

-what Andrew did was wrong. But criminal assault? Do they even know what that means? No one is defending Andrew’s actions- he should be punished. But explusion with criminal charges? That’s downright reminiscent of Singapore.

I’m also not sure about bringing the case to The View, but knowing Andrew’s father as a decent and honorable man, a Marine, I am pretty sure he felt he had no choice. And I doubt sincerely the Mikels are guilty of bad parenting.

I’ve certainly made my share of mistakes in this life, we all have. I’m not sure judging this kid so harshly reflects the best of us as a society.

Perhaps we should consider the student. I think the school is in place to benifit him as well as the other students. The proper administration of disapline is normally of benifit but going to extremes as it has in this case is of benifit to no one including the other students. It is however very distructive to the student involved, is that nessasary? Any school official should be able to handle this type of incident without harming the students involved. If handled properly the student would have been disaplined only to the point of correcting his behavior. That is the goal of disapline.

How the school administration or the school board can justify thier actions is a mystery to me and highlights thier failure, not the students.

To the Sherrif’s dept., I will rest so much easier knowing you are ready and available to respond to such dangerous and violent situations. You have failed as well.

Donna you right. What he use is lighter than a spitwad and was froma toy gun he had years age bought form the toy dept. We have never said was nto wrong in what he did. He got a 10 suspension as well as consequences at home. You can go look hight and low for the rest of the story but there is none. You want to believe there is more because you know the rest of his punishment was excessive. So the Rutherford Lawyers and all the press he has been getting is because they have the whole story and agree that the punishment was excessive. I know there are people no matter what you tell them are just going to be stuck in their mindsets. You are right we should just have a punishment per crime. WE could get rid of all the investigators, lawyers, jury etc. If you speed no matter how much over lose your license. If you murder all should be put to death. But most of us know that it would never work. What kids really read the code of conduct?? I guess you keep missing the point that he was punished. I can only hope you never serve on a jury. I guess you would think hanging would be appropriate punishment for jaywalking just because someone wrote it that way. I have never read that his behavior is being glorified. The attention is on Spotsy HS and the ridiculus actions of the VP and the school board. In case you haven’t heard there has been a lawsuit filed in the Circuit Court yesterday to have the excessive punishment overturned.

There is a pattern in these Zero Tolerance decisions. This Mikel incident is not the only incident that creates concern that the schools are overstepping their authority and abusing it to boot. Something lighter than a spitwad is not a weapon. The boy is not claiming innocence he and his father have expressed regret that Andrew chose to play with that infamous pen and little plastic pellets. Obviously he annoyed someone. But a year’s detention and a visit by the police? This is unnecessarily oppressive reaction reflects a lack of sound judgment; reflecting a maliciousness towards our students that was not exhibited by Andrew himself. I think this should go to trial to show the false witness the school used to make this a bigger issue than it was in order to justify their insane decision and the lack of compassion and common sense they exhibited. Lying and bearing false witness is a bigger crime than foolish non aggressive lunchtime play.

Brandy,

Once again. No reasonable person could interpret the section on weapons in the Code of Conduct to include pens or spitballs. Please quote the part of the Code of Conduct that so obviously states that pens or spitballs are weapons, so clear that a 14 year old would understand.

Brandy,
Get past the point that the action was wrong, I believe every post agrees with that.
So a 14 year old can clearly see that shooting a spitball in the Code of Conduct results in criminal charges and expulsion. Give me a break,! I believe it has been stated the kid knows it was wrong, and discipline appropriate to the incident was called for. It is not the incident and appropriate discipline being questioned here, it is the resulting insane punishment that equates a pen casing to a rifle. I think your 14 year old would agree that a pen is not a rifle or shotgun.

@Libby, please STOP referring to the plastic pellets as SPITBALLS, they were not spitballs.
@Bob G from your post on 2/9 at 5:25pm. You checking IP addresses?? REALLY you don’t have anything better to do. Taking pot shots at the teachers, staff and administrators of Spotsy County schools. Are you trying to say they are posting during school time. Why beat around the bush with your comment. Come out and say what you have to say. Do you realize that anyone can hop on Spotsy County’s wifi if they are within range? Hummmm
@Brandy, I’m thinking like you. A projectile doesn’t have to be a gun or rifle. Andrew Mikel knowlingly and willfully took the projectile along with his pellets to school with the intention to what??? Carry them around in his pocket all day? NO, he took them to use them exactly how he did and got into trouble for it. Face the consequences of your actions. If the victims he shot with the pellets had turned around and decked him, what then??? He didn’t choose victims that would of stood up to him, he chose victims who wouldn’t and he knows that (that my friends is the definition of a bully). My hats off to the victims for telling the administration that is what they should have done. Let the adults handle the situation. With zero tolerance if they would have fought back then they too would have been suspended. Mr. Mikel (dad) has challenged the schools before and lost and I can only hope that happens again. He must like to see his name in print and in the media. He writes enough letters to the editor. He doesn’t like to be pointed out as being wrong. He refuses to accept that he and his son are wrong. Grandmother Mikel also is clueless in her remarks about Andrew’s behavior. I would think that the Naval Academy in Annapolis or wherever he wanted to go is watching this debacle and just shaking their heads. Please remember you’ve only heard one side of the story. When this goes to court, the prior disciplinary reports will be released and it will be a whole new ball game. I’ve been told during a 10 suspension the school has the right to file for an expulsion which is exactly what happened in this case. If my child were one of the victims, you’d have to carry me kicking and screaming away from this situation. Justice would be served. My child deserves to go to school in a safe, bully free environment. Enough said.

Mr. Mikel did bring an issue up to the school board several years back, you are correct. The issue was that one of his children brought a book home from school that included a 19 year old man having sexual relations with a 15 year old girl. Mr. Mikel thought it a bit inappropriate for young children. It also gave instructions to young girls to “not take your own pants off, but to let the boys do it for you.”

Shame on him! Yes he lost, and yes the book is still available to young children, including your own Donna.

The boy should have been suspended, but not expelled. I hope his father wins, and schools get a little more balanced. Everybody is just too hyper about violence right now. These are not prisons, where everything can be used as a deadly weapon.